Get Started

Laura Michael is Rewire's newest coach and Professional Certified Coach, focusing primarily on Leadership Coaching. Laura is a communication connoisseur with a passion for helping individuals break free from societal expectations and embrace their true potential. She has spent over 20 years in corporate America, and currently owns and operates Professional Box Breaker, where she provides leadership coaching programs to organizations as an employee benefit for rising leaders. Through her own experiences and coaching conversations, Laura inspires others to navigate their own paths with confidence and embrace the freedom of living outside the box.

 

In this episode, Jason and Laura discuss:

  • Transitioning Outside the Box
  • Embracing Empowerment Over Fear
  • Overcoming Barriers in Communication & Respecting Different Interpretations
  • Shifting Mindset towards Personal Responsibility
  • The Value of Coaching for All Levels

Key Takeaways:

  • Mastering the art of making empowered career choices
  • Unveiling the hidden benefits of professional coaching
  • Navigating the transition from corporate to entrepreneurship with confidence
  • Enhancing leadership skills through powerful communication strategies
  • Cultivating self-trust as a catalyst for personal growth

 

“The choice can come from two places. The choice can come from a place of power, or it can come from a place of fear. And when we choose from a place of fear, usually the fear is keeping us inside of our comfort zone, it just keeps us safe, keeps us protected, nothing is at rest and when we choose from a place of power, we're actually believing in ourselves."

 - Laura Michael

Connect with Laura Michael:

Website

LinkedIn

Email

Connect with Steve and Jason:

 

Listen to the podcast here:

Laura Michael- Breaking Boxes     

            

Hello and welcome, everybody to this episode of the Insight interviews. I'm your host, Jason Abel. I'm glad to be here with you today. I'm even more glad to be with today's guest, Laura Michael. Laura, I'll give you just a little tidbit and then I'll have her introduce herself, but Laura is Rewire's newest coach that's on board and we're very excited about that. But in addition to that, she is the founder of Professional Box Breaker, which we need to get into. She is a professional, certified coach in the coaching industry, that's a PCC, and anybody who knows anything about certifications and coaching knows that all the cool kids, which there aren't that many of them, are PCCs, so that is very cool. She's also a communication connoisseur and just an all-around great person. Laura, welcome to the show.

Oh, thank you, Jason, for that warm welcome. It makes me feel all happy inside.

Well, that's a great place to start from.

Yeah.

If you've listened to any episodes, and I know you well enough because we've had a few discussions about this, to know that you have listened to a couple of episodes. You know that before we get into all the wonderful things that we're about to get into around leadership and insights and communication and all that, the first question that I'd like to ask is today, as you and I engage each other, Laura, what are you grateful for?

Yes, I have seen and heard this question and I love it. I think it starts us off on such a thoughtful note. I personally am grateful today and every day for this newfound freedom to live outside of the box. You know, I revel in this every day. I have been able to tell a difference in my own life, in the lives of my clients, for having this permission to live life the way we say and outside of any social limits or limits of what other people expect from us. And so, I think the real core of it is just freedom. So that's what I'm grateful for today, I think Jason, is just freedom.

I'm already taking notes like, are you kidding me, people? We're already dropping philosophical truth bombs here. And what I'm going to do is I'm going to pull us out of the deep end of the pool real quick, but I want us to dive back in. But while we're out for a minute, because I definitely want to dig into some of the things that you said, in introducing you, I gave some of your stats, if you know will, who you are, what you've done. Would you mind just giving the listeners those that aren't familiar with Laura Michael, would you just tell us a little bit about yourself and who you are and why would you even be on a podcast like the Insight Interviews?

Yeah, sure. Let me think about where to start here.

Yeah, I know I stacked a lot of questions there, which is really, when you go to podcast host school, they tell you not to do that. So, pick any of those questions that you want and just roll with it.

Okay, I will. So, I guess if I were to sum up my story real quick. I am a person who has forever been on a very straight trajectory of life, where I knew what was expected of me next and next and next. And I followed those steps very carefully and in a very straight and narrow kind of way, and I got this life that everybody says you should have. You've got the house and the two kids and the great job and the white picket fence, and I had achieved all of those stereotypical positive norms, and I realized that I was not fulfilled. There was something missing for me in that. You know, this was early forties. I was kind of coming to this mid middle of my life. What's next for me? What is this all about? Why am I here? What's my purpose? And I think I just really had a moment of shift where I realized the boxes, and we're going to talk, I suppose, a lot about boxes and how I speak about them and define them, but you know, I said, I don't have to live this way. These boxes, this structure, this expectation that I've been living within and not even seeing is not how it has to be. And that's kind of the freedom that I talk about now, is just recognizing the boxes and seeing them and then realizing that you can play outside of them. And so, at that point in my life, I shifted to really understanding what it was that brought me joy in my life. And that was being in a one-on-one conversation or a small group conversation with individuals who wanted something more, something different, a different perspective to achieve something in their lives that they didn't know how to go after. And so, I turned to coaching, and for the last four or five years, I've been in a coaching conversation in all parts of my life. So, it's been a coaching conversation about myself and what is it that I want from my life? What does that journey look like for me? It's been a coaching conversation that I'm in constantly with my clients, with my team, with the people in my life, with you. And so, I think that's where I find myself now, is just really reveling in this conversation about possibility and what lives outside of the boxes and what it is that we want to create, like, in our heart, what is it you really want? And then breaking down all of those barriers, breaking down those walls of the boxes, to enable us to go out and get what it is that we truly, truly want.

For me, and I know because you and I have known each other now for, I don't know, it'll be a year and a few months, something like that. And we've had many discussions. I know you well enough to know that you are a person that walks the path that you talk about. And so what I mean by that, when you talk about, hey, I did all the things inside the box and all worked out, but golly, is that it, type of thing? And so, you went from a point in time where you were doing all that kind of playing the game and then to not like corporate America, working up the ladder, doing the thing, and then now you're a founder of a company, you're very independent. You're having the freedom, at least that I can tell that you're describing. But, boy, that's a leap, right? There's many listeners that we have that are maybe thinking about taking that leap or did take that leap. I think what I'm asking specifically is going from inside that box to making the decision, and now I'm outside the box. Could you just talk a little bit about that decision or that transitionary period, like anything that strikes you about that moment or that period of time? Boy, I'd love you to speak to that.

Yeah, sure. A lot of people leave a job or a profession because things aren't going well, and I think I have this luxury. I have the gift of being able to say that I didn't leave because things weren't going well, I left because it was what's next for me. And I think a lot of people who know me very well know that I often choose into the scary thing, the pushing me outside of my own comfort zone in service of my growth, like what is next, what is possible? And for me, the big scary thing was always entrepreneurship, was always being on my own. It took a lot of work for me to get to a point where I was fearless enough to know in my heart that that was what's next for me and to say, let's just do it. Let's just see what happens. And I'll tell you what. I was in corporate America for so long, that life outside of that comfort box, outside know a paycheck and benefits, it is wild.

I happen to know what you're talking about. But for our listeners, what do you mean wild?

Well, it's literally just the complete absence of a box, right? There are no limits. There are no limits to my time. There's nobody telling me, this is when your workday starts and when your workday ends. Here's what you should be doing during your workday. And so, it's really this place of complete creation where whatever I say is what it is. And some days, maybe it's a little too much freedom I've given myself, right?      

Sure.

For that reason, it can be a little scary, right? Entrepreneurship, I think anytime you talk to any entrepreneur, they're going to tell you, some days are a little scary.

Yeah.

And I think that is the thing I was scared of in pushing myself outside of that comfort zone. And what I'm realizing now is scary is, okay, there's a certain level of fear and anxiety that comes with being scared, but there's also this excitement and curiosity and an opportunity to be more introspective about why it's scary, rather than just allowing it to consume you or overwhelm you. It's like, okay, well, what's scary about this? What is it exactly that I'm afraid of? And you know what, Jason? The thing that has really hit me is the opportunity to create trust in myself. And when you trust yourself and you know yourself, to be incredible in your own right, when you believe that you are worthy and wonderful, it's amazing what you can create.

So, many of our listeners are in the shoes that you're describing you were in, in corporate America. Some of them may want to go from this level to this level, some of them may want to break out on a little side hustle that they've always been thinking about, some of them are thinking they've already done that, they're founders, and they're thinking, well, should I acquire? Should I be acquired? Like, in other words, there's a lot of listeners that are thinking about a growth or a transition or something outside of their existing box. Is there anything, I don't know, if you had an opportunity to whisper in their ear right now, is there anything in particular that would be contained in that message?

Yeah, I think that this is something that comes up with my clients a lot, too, is you reach these moments in your career where you have to make a choice in your career, in your life, anywhere, really, and the way I like to look at it is that the choice can come from two places. The choice can come from a place of power, or it can come from a place of fear. And when we choose from a place of fear, usually, generally, the fear is keeping us inside of our comfort zone. It's just keeping us safe, keeping us protected. Nothing is at risk. And when we choose from a place of power, we're actually believing in ourselves. We're believing in the adventure in what feels right, what our body and our mind and our heart is telling us, and I think there's actually this whole thing that happens physiologically. Like, you can actually feel the difference between choosing from a place of power and choosing from a place of fear. Maybe it's like the choosing from a place of power may actually feel a little bit more uncomfortable. Physiologically, you may actually have a little bit more of a tingly sensation, whereas choosing from a place of fear says, okay, we're just going to get right back in.

Right back in the box, right? Yeah, that tingly feeling is likely because it's different than what you've done before. As I listen to you, I think of the position of power versus the posture of fear, and I think about things like negotiations or compensation discussions or whatever. But what I heard you just say was position of power with yourself first and then engage whatever the transition, that's the question that I asked you, or change or growth. So really having a posture of power with yourself and trust in yourself, rather than maybe the fear, which sometimes grips more often than not.

Yeah, it's a good distinction you're making, because a place of power over other people may not actually serve us. And when I say power, I mean, like, empowerment.

Yes.        

I think that maybe the word that resonates more is a self-empowerment to choose from who we know ourselves to be.

For our listeners, and it's probably more self-serving than anything else, Laura, when I hear you, I'm agreeing with you, right? Like, the authentic self, which we may go down that path for a minute. Trusting in yourself, empowerment, confidence in yourself. I'm nodding my head, going, yes, put me in that camp. Like I'm in agreement with you. Is there a story or an example that you can think of, like a real life, anything that comes to mind, I don't know, if it's a client, obviously, you have to protect anonymity there or an observation that you've made that would illustrate the point that you're making right now?

Yeah. And I guess I go back to the choices that I made for a long time. There were several moments in my career where I thought there might be different options for me. There might be a different path. And for years upon years, the choice was from fear. The choice was this is good enough. This is good enough. I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing. This is what they told me I was supposed to be doing. And I'm getting a nice paycheck, and I have good benefits, and that's what my family deserves and the whole narrative, right? It's very convincing.        

Sure.

And I only in retrospect can see that those were choices from a place of fear. And I'm not beating myself up about it. It is what it is. Those were the right choices for me at that moment. And I think that the differentiating choice from a place of power, from my own empowerment, was to leave. And it was scary, and it was bold and brave and the tingling and all of it, right? So, that was a choice that came after a long series of choices, from a place of power that started when I saw the boxes I was in.        

Sure.

I think that that really started the unpacking.

Yeah. No, thank you. Yeah. Using yourself as the example, as the illustration. What better topic do you know than that, right? So, I hear that. What you're talking about is being true to yourself, finding that power within and kind of the authentic self. Complete devil's advocate here for a minute. There might be people that are listening, that are inside whatever their box is, and they're listening to you going, well, that's cool for you, but I got these responsibilities that I got to take care of. I've got, I don't know, a mortgage to pay, in the most elementary example, like, okay, authentic self sounds really great and trusting in myself and having empowerment, but I don't even know the first couple of steps. I'm just trying to think like you did it and that's insane. You're in the middle of doing it right now and you talked at the top of the show about freedom with the wild ride and those types of things. But I don't know, after the trusting in yourself, what are some steps to go, man, let me poke out of this box, like break that actual box.

Yeah. I don't think it has to be like a shattering, right? It doesn't have to be quite so big as leaving a career and starting your own business. It doesn't have to be so severe to just be a choice from a place of power. I think when we're listening to our bodies and we're listening to what our souls are telling us, we're choosing from a place of power. So even in that being in a coaching conversation and talking about who you want to be as a leader, who you truly want to be as a leader, that's a choice from a place of power rather than showing up for your people as a leader and you’re fearful, right? There's so many fears that can come in when we're a leader. Will they like me? Am I doing a good job? Am I being too hard on them? Am I serving them? There's so much doubt that can creep in as a leader. And when you lead from a place of fear where you're listening to those voices and that criticism, it can be just a moment of the way that we choose to show up, that is breaking a box for ourselves.

Yeah, very good. I'm going to change gears with your permission.

Sure.

One of the ways that you describe yourself and that I've observed you, even if you didn't describe yourself like this, is a real communication expert. I think you use the word communication connoisseur, and I've noticed with you, even during this conversation, Laura, you and I have had plenty of conversations where we've gotten to know one another. I'm learning from you right now at a deeper level than I have before. So, you're showing me that you're a communications expert, but I find with our clients, there's so many things that just boil down to communication. This person doesn't understand. Why don't they get it? I can't believe, you know, whatever. And there's a communication that needs to occur to either mend the fence, make the breakthrough, get the project progressed further. When you think of your connoisseurship around communication, what types of things come to mind?        

Yeah, communication connoisseur is my fun play on alliteration. I love it. Let me think about this for one sec, because I have some thoughts on communication as it pertains to leadership and introspection and personal development, and I also have some thoughts on how we communicate as people and how we can break down barriers in that way. So, I guess I'll start with communication and how we use it for ourselves. There are certain words that we use that have a big impact on us. And when we do something just as simple as switching one word in even the way we're thinking to ourselves, it can have a huge impact. So, I'll give you an example. When we believe ourselves to be so busy that we have no breathing room. Sorry, I can't get up and take a walk for myself to clear my head. I just don't have the time. Right? And my calendar is back-to-back to back. I have back-to-back meetings all day. Okay, so there's a story I like to tell about- it comes from the book the Big Leap by Gay Hendrix, and it's about the difference in the distinction between having time and making time. And when we believe that we have time, it's a limited commodity. There is only so much of it to go around. It's a feeling of trying to hold on to and preserve as much of it as possible, and we are at the liberty of the clock. The clock has the power, and we are its servant.

Yup.

Whereas when we have this mentality that we make time, we actually are the creators of our own time, then it puts a responsibility back on us and gives us our control back. We get to say, I'm choosing to make time for the things that are important to me, for my priorities, and it changes the dynamic when we have a conversation about being busy. I used to say all the time, I'm just too busy. I can't fit it in today. This week is crazy busy. Let's talk next week. Whenever. You've heard all of this. Everybody's heard all of this.

Heard it. I've said it.

Yeah, right. And so, I think when we stop allowing ourselves to use the word busy, because busy is something we do to ourselves, but it also, at the same time, removes the responsibility from us. It says, I'm busy and it's not my fault, right? I’m busy and it's not on me. It's being done to me. And so, when we remove the use of that word, I used to start saying, I've overbooked myself today, right? I take the responsibility back on me. And then I have a choice as to what I want to do with that. Do I need to be in all of those meetings? Did I give myself some space to breathe? Did I reserve myself a lunch break? So, I think that's one place where the language that we use, the actual words that we use, can be so impactful for us in our own experiences of life. And then in terms of the way that we interact with other people and how communication plays in there, I think it all comes down to interpretation and being open to another person's interpretation of life. I like to say the fact is energy agnostic. It has no effect. No energy attached to it, and the interpretation is the energetic overlay that we attach to the fact.

So, well put. Yes.

And when we are able to see our own interpretation and identify it as either empowering or disempowering, then we're able to see other people's interpretations, too. And we're able to say, your interpretation is not the same as mine, however, it's yours, and there's nothing I can do to change your interpretation. Interpretations are based on our past experiences of life. They're built through who we are as a person and how we got here. And so, what I love about interpretations is no interpretation is the same. They all have their own unique detail and their own unique dynamics. And interpretations are not right or wrong. They are what they are, and they're a story about a fact. And you don't have to agree with someone's interpretation in order to respect it. And so, I think when we're talking about communications, when you boil it down to the interpretation, oftentimes communication is about your interpretation is different than mine. And so, we're going to get into it. Well, if I come to a conversation expecting and understanding that you're going to have a different interpretation than I am, then it creates an opportunity for connection. What is your interpretation? Share with me about it. I want to know what you're thinking.

There are, gosh, I think we could have a whole episode just on the topic that you're hitting on right now. I can think of three or four examples in my past where it would have been really nice to embody and use some of the stuff that you just said. This communication piece and even that, I hearken back to what you've said there's a thread here that I'm sensing this whole trusting yourself and operating from a position of power via trusting yourself versus fear and not trusting yourself. And I think the more of that that you have, the better communicator that you have the opportunity to be, because of just what you said, right? If I'm operating from fear, the likelihood of me being open to what your interpretation is, especially if it's different than my interpretation of whatever the agnostic fact is that you described, it's just going to be tougher for me if I don't believe in myself and I'm operating from fear. So, yeah, it's really good. That is really good. Yeah. I don't know. I do feel like we need to do an entire episode just on that. As we start to head towards home and completing this episode, Laura, is there anything that I have not asked you that you want to make sure that we touch on today?

I guess the only thing I can think of that would be tied to what we've already spoken about today is the opportunity for everyone at any level, at any point in their life, to be in this conversation. I'm so passionate about how some people are given access to these conversations very readily in their career. Executives, once you get to a certain point in an organization, you're given access to this type of thoughtful conversation, this type of introspection, and I'm so enthusiastic about everyone being worthy already, regardless of where they are in their career, regardless of what phase of life they're in, being worthy of this conversation and being better for it. So, I guess that's my whole mission in what I do, is bringing this conversation to leaders that are more junior in their journey, more at the front end, at the midpoint of their journey. The executives who we know are already in these conversations, by and large, which is great, but I think that the opportunity to really change culture across the workforce and across our lives in connection with people starts a lot earlier than it has historically these days.

Yeah, I mean, what I'm hearing from you, just in its simplest form, sometimes I need to break it down for myself, and so I think what you're saying is coaching conversations in particular have been open to executives and leaders. Executive coaching, right? It's a term. It's a thing. Been available. The opportunity has been made available to executives for a long, long time in corporate America. And today we're seeing some glimpses of coaching conversations being afforded to more junior leadership and maybe even, like you say, more aspiring leaders, because you and I have touched on this a little bit with one another. Boy, we just want to see that grow and grow because it'll be better for the individual, but it'll also be better for the organization, right? If not just these good coaching, in depth conversations on the topics that we've been talking about were afforded to more people in an organization besides just the executives.        

Yeah. Gallup says that the employee experience begins and ends with the manager, and I could not agree more. I think when you enter an organization, the person who will be your leader has absolutely impactful role in how you experience that job and at any level. So for us to, in the work that you and I do, be providing that support, be providing that opportunity to folks at that point in their career, to be so thoughtful about who it is they want to be as a leader and how they want to show up for that new role or those people that they're leading is a gift that I've seen starting to create some real traction in industry. We're starting to get to a point where employees are asking for this. They are saying, I need this type of support because the learning and education and training that I've received up to this point has made me a great technical professional. I know how to do my technical job, and now I have this new responsibility to lead people. And my training up to this point has not supported me in knowing how to do that, knowing who I want to be, so, what is the support that we can give to that person right then and there? And I believe that it's not a classroom training. I believe that that is a softer skill. It's an emotional intelligence. It's about knowing yourself so that you can be with others.        

Yeah, maybe a third episode, right? Yeah, that's so good. I do often see, and I remember I was 21 years in corporate America myself, Laura, and I did see, oh, we need to increase sensitivity among our culture, among our team. Let's bring in a sensitivity expert and let's go to a classroom, 2 hours so we can check that box off. And it's like, no, that may actually have the opposite effect that you're looking to have. But coaching conversations one on one to raise the level of all the things that you're talking about and ultimately leading to things that you started off with at the top of our conversation, about trusting yourself and operating from a position of empowerment in yourself to then be able to lead others. Again, good for you, good for the people on your team, good for the organization. And so, yeah, I happen to very much agree with you, not just because both of us own coaching companies, but because, I don't know, I just see know to be true. So yeah, thanks for bringing that topic up, Laura, so good. Thank you for being on the show. Thank you for being a professional box breaker. Thank you for being so authentic with us today. People can find you on our site at Rewireinc.com, on your site at Professionalboxbreaker.com, on LinkedIn. I know you're very fond of writing. You guys, go to LinkedIn, look at some of the stuff that Laura has written. Really good stuff that will help you operate from a position of power yourself. So, Laura, can't thank you enough for being on the show today. Thank you.

Thank you, Jason. I always enjoy our conversations, whether it be tactical or existential or philosophical. Yeah, today was great. Thank you so much for having me.

And I do hope to have you again. So, I don't know, I'm just going to get it on the record. You think we can do another one of these sometime in the future?          

You got it. Yes.

You heard it here.

It's happening.

Laura, thank you so much.   
     

All right, thanks, Jason.        

Wow. Laura Michael and her insights. Golly, where do I start? There was a thread that ran through the insights that I took away from Laura. Just this idea of operating from a position of power or a position of fear, and she actually substituted the word choice for position. You're choosing to be self-empowered or we're choosing to operate from fear. And then that thread went in through of interpreting things, being empowering or disempowering. This idea of having time versus trusting in yourself to make time, living outside the box just so good. But those were my insights, and I'm going to be taking notes on trying to think more about my insights. But as we end every episode of the Insight Interviews, it doesn't much matter what my insights were, dear listener, but what were your insights today?        

---

Thanks for reading. If you got any value at all from this episode, a little nugget all the way up to some big huge insight, please do us a solid by subscribing, recommending, rating, and reviewing us on Apple Podcast, Spotify, or Google. That stuff matters to us, and it allows us to continue interviewing more awesome people.



Important Links
, , , , ,

Lead Magnet

  • First cool thing
  • Second cool thing
  • Third cool thing
Download